『Outrenoir』— ピエール・スーラージュの創作の軌跡をたどる詩的な没入型伝記体験

The Voices of VR Podcast. called Peter Solange. And so Ort Menor is sort of like beyond black. And so a lot of his paintings and art is around ways that he's playing with light and black and this kind of really evocative paintings that you hear a bit about the biographical story and history as you go through this kind of spatial journey of his past, documenting the evolution of his art, culminating to an art show and a location. And Art Police has this really kind of beautiful exhibition of this white void space that has a deep contrast to the Ort Menor our art pieces. So this is a piece also by Lucid Realities, which has been doing a lot of really

amazing collaborations with cultural institutions. So Chloe Jerry has been doing really smart location-based entertainment, you know, these co-productions, but also always making sure that there's like a means in which that some of these projects that they're creating is going to have a home at these different cultural institutions and museums, but also kind of touring around to other different cultural institutions and museums. And so it's kind of like a very niche location-based entertainment approach that seems to be working out really well. So this elemental genre is earth water, the earth being like this immersive world, you're being transported through a series of different spatial contexts, and the water element being this kind of biographic and poetic exploration of Pierre Szilagy's biography. And so it's kind of telling the story of his life in this more cinematic way in terms of you're going through these spaces, but it's also this cinematic quality to it as you're watching it. And some interactive components as well. They're not super highlighted, but they do have different kind of participatory moments to have you feel a little bit more engaged, which is a little bit surprising just in terms of like some

of the times these are audiences that are brand new to VR, but there's still like these kind of light interactions to get people even more engaged. So we're covering all that and more on today's episode of the Voice of the VR podcast. So this interview with Gordon and Chloe happened on Sunday, September 6th, 2026, at Venice Immersive in Venice, Italy. So, with that, let's go ahead and dive right in. Hello, my name is Gordon. I'm a director. I'm also a stage director, movie director. And I'm here in Venice for Outre Noir. It's an experience about Pierre Soulages. Hello, my name is Chloé, Chloé Zary. I am the CEO of Licid Realities, that is a production company and a studio, also a distribution company based in Paris. And I am the producer of Outre Noir. Nice. Maybe could each give a bit more context as to your background in your journey in working with immersive storytelling. I come from the graphic design and after a long career on this, I decided to make more

direction, art direction, and after I met Chloe and together we made a lot of iPad application about musical movies I made and together we build a large collection of VR. Okay, so my background comes from different fields. I first worked in publishing and museum, art books, catalogs for exhibitions. And I mixed that quite a long time ago now with production of design for interactive TV and interactive website. And then in 2009, I decided to mix the two careers in one only.

And I created a first company called Le Book Lab. That was the idea to bring videos and sound in digital books. And then I began to produce interactive experience. First web documentaries and app with Gordon, but also immersive project. My very first immersive project was The Enemy. We produced between 2013 and 2017 under the name of Camera Lucida Production. It was one of the first free-warming multi-user experience with Karim Ben-Helifa as a director. And then I opened Lucid Realities in 2018. We produced quite a lot of VR, but also immersive experience.

Awesome, yeah. And so I had a chance to see Art Noir. And so my audience has not seen it yet. So maybe you could describe what is Art Noir and what is the story that you wanted to tell. Outre Noir is the piece of life of Pierre Soulages, in fact. I think I made some souvenirs of his life, a documentary a lot of his life. And I used a lot of memories, a lot of text about his life. and I cut this little piece like touch of his life. And it's not the narrative way of doing it, it was also the music and of course the voice. Pierre Soulages documented his work extensively and I built the experience from autobiographical accounts, from interviews with journalists and even poets.

but all these thoughts did not allow me to create the voiceover for the experience and we had the chance to have a close connection with Isabelle Huppert because she loved the family of Pierre Sauvage and she wants to give us her voice for the experience. We have this luck. I'm curious how you came across this project or if this project, where it began and is it something that you had an idea for or where did it originate? Yeah, in fact, we are working together with Gordon for quite a lot of decades now and I think we always try to bring audiences knowing better some very well-known artists and painting in particular but also music is something we try to get out of the museums and using a new technology.

So we produced already several projects around very well-known painters like Van Gogh or Matisse with Dance Dance Dance Matisse that was here last year. But with Kersoulage, I think it was much more close connection. first because we both really love Pierre Soulage's work and so we wanted to do something around this painter and especially the Outre Noir and we had the opportunity to meet Le Musée Fabre that is a museum in south of France that is also a museum that was really really important in Pierre Soulage's life because the art school he did before World War II was located in this museum. So he spent quite a lot of time in this museum. He really liked the location, but also the building and also, of course, the collection.

That's where he met his wife. And Piazzola's wife is quite important also. She's still alive. She's 104 years old. So she really spent the whole life with her husband and supporting his work and all that. And when we met Musée Fab, they were preparing a big exhibition, the very first exhibition after Piersoulage passed away. So it was a good connection, of course, because when we decided to go in production, we always want to have at least the first venue involved in the production and we will be able to present of course the project so we worked with one of the curators of this museum who was quite close also from Pierre Soulages and his wife she know of course very well his work

Pierre Soulages also did a donation of 32 I think 32 paintings that are now in a special health of the museum. He designed the health with the architect. He, of course, decided of the way to present the paintings inside. So he was really involved in all that. And we decided to bring this story and the story of the installation in the museum very closely. and so Gordon wrote a first script after months and weeks and like diving in his memories and archives and in fact I think the final version is not so different than the first script it was really the idea to have this very long traveling from his childhood to the end and still in the experience now.

Anything you wanted to add? Yeah, the experience is a quest of light. In fact, the work of Pierre Soulages is not the black, but really how light is on his work, and also the place we have when we reflect on this painting. That's why you are led to illuminate caves or ancestral caves. You will also scrap away layers of paint to uncover the color. And finally, you will literally dive into the black paint material. And that's the culminant point. It's the moment where he invented the first Outre-Noir. is 60 years old and it's more important moment of his life and you are living this literally and so what does

Otenor mean and there's a lot of black in his paintings I don't know if it is referring to that but what is the translation for what that word means black maybe beyond black but it's you know I think it's like outre mer is blue color he thought he could invent a new color and it called Outre Noir So he named it Yeah he named it exactly So are his paintings known as like a genre of Outre Noir Yeah, Pierre Soulas didn't name this different painting. You only have the date of the final touch, I guess. But he was speaking about the Outre Noir collection, and I don't know how many paintings he did really only in black but with these curves the volumes and all these different things so the light can be reflected but the

Outre Noir was really the way he called at the same time all this collection of paintings but also this type of painting I would say Pierre Soulages started painting at age 20 and it was only age at 60, 40 years later that he created the first Outre Noir. He would go on producing them for another 40 years. What an incredible career. Nice. I wanted to go back to something that you were saying, Chloe, in terms of collaborating with the cultural institutions because I know I've had a chance to see a number of lucid reality pieces over the years and actually when I was at New Images a number of years ago, So there was like a place to go see a bunch of different types of experiences from the different VR distributors. And Lucid Realities has a number of pieces that were in that collection that were usually only available at these like cultural institutions in and around like France.

And so I've not had a chance to travel to all those places, but I had a chance to see a bunch of those that I would normally not be able to see had I not been at the new images to see some of those pieces. But maybe just comment a little bit about your strategy that you have with Lucid Realities in terms of bringing on co-producers or at least having a good sense in your mind of before you dive into a piece that it's going to have a home or a cultural institution that's going to be able to properly put it in the right context and to have the audience and the throughput of people coming through to see the art that would also want to have this additional immersive experience to learn more about the biography or stories of these artists. yeah I think that's really in the area of lucid realities to work with cultural institutions we always try to bring them as co-producers that means that none of our productions are a commission it's really something we want to do and we offer a cultural institution to be part of it they bring money but they bring also

knowledge in the project but they are always on a minor part of the financial plan, if I say. And especially, of course, we want the project to be presented in the museum or in the cultural institution, but the reason why we want to have a co-production is so we keep the rights, and after the first presentation in this museum, specific museum the VR experience go to tour and Van Gogh's palette for example went in more 30 different venues all over the world it premiered at the Musée d'Orsay but then he went in different cultural institutions abroad in Shanghai in very very different places but also in a more commercial network and that's also what we like is that we can go and The image of the museum can go outside of the museum, not only in cultural institutions, but also in cultural venues, even in commercial places, and also in libraries.

We have a big network of libraries that present VR, of course, in a very small installation. Sometimes it's only one, two, or three headsets. But for us, it's also a way to bring people to VR and to art. And that's very, very important in our NDA, to bring this out of the museums. And we think that to have this partnership with a big institution can open other doors. and also for the museum it's a way to go outside of their own network and to reach other audiences. So the idea is really to bring it everywhere. Nice. So as you sat down and write the script, just curious, what was your first encounter with Pierre Siflage? What did you first come across as art? Ah, wow. A long time ago I was art student, of course, and I really appreciate his work.

And it was amazing. There is also a big exposition in Centre Georges Pompidou in Paris. It was amazing. It was like a revelation for me. Yeah, of course. So when you're starting to sit down and to write the script, where do you begin? I think we can talk about music because I work like a podcast, you know. the timeline of the experience I first put words of Pierre Soulages I record it and music that's the way I edit the experience and for me it's really important I use Jean-Michel Jarre Beethoven, Vivaldi during this experience it was really important to build a continuity something working with the sound and the words, and after we build the pictures, we build the scene and

all the sets. And so just to follow on from that, it sounds like that you are very musically driven of getting inspired by the music, and so when you were writing the script, did you already have the music laid out before you were writing the script, or did you write the script first, before you had the musical tracks? Yeah, at the same time, it's a double way to work and to invent things. And it's a starter for the pictures. It's a starter for the moments I want to build for the experience. And so, because you were writing the script, what was your process for collaborating with other people, either the art museum to get information, or was there books that he wrote, or I'm just trying to get a sense of where you got the information about the story of who this artist was. Yeah, it was a lot of different texts. It was also interview. It was also a documentary about Pierre Soulages

and also poetry about Pierre Soulages and also podcast. I remember one about the rugby, you know, about the ball, the form of the ball, the way Pierre Soulages worked because it is aléatoire. You say this? Aléatoire? Aléatoire? Yeah, aléatoire. You understand aléatoire? What is it? It's when the ball just comes down and goes this way or this way. You don't know exactly. And the way Pierre Soulages work was like this. He's not an artisan. He's not producing something he knew. He doesn't know exactly what he's doing. and it is the perfect way of art, in fact. You can't explain this. It's just the way he did it. So it's a little variance or probability or chance operations where he doesn't know exactly how it's going to come out, but there's things that he's doing to embrace the random chaos of sorts.

Exactly, exactly. At the end of the experience, you say you can't explain art. you just you can just leave it yeah I think that for about your question about the collaboration with the museum we really try to keep the museum as an advisor and not at the place that they know what they want to see in the experience so the way we worked and especially for Outre Noir we went first to the museum it was a museum we did not know, neither Gordon nor me, and Maud, the curator, she made for us a visit of the museum. So she was talking, talking, talking about Pierre Soulages, about some stories she had with him, and some discussion she knows about him, some influence he had, And so I saw Gordon was taking notes like that.

And then we went back in the office and you spent weeks just diving in the articles, some documentaries, as you were saying, articles, interviews. And then we have a first script and we send it to Maud. And she reacted, but she was really not influencing. she was just correcting like you take this extract of what she said but maybe it was not exactly at the good time and so it's quite a discussion but it was maybe one or two it was one or two discussions it was not a lot of time but she knows of course Pierre Soulage very well and his career and his painting so she was able to react very actively to that and then we had a discussion about the last sentence we hear but I think that the only one

she really did a specific research for that because she had an idea with what she wanted the audience to get out of the experience and so they had a discussion about that yeah exactly yeah we formed together and the last sentence is painting is above all a poetic experience it's not a metaphor it cannot be explained that's it i think that's it yeah so yeah i guess there's also a whole visual journey that we're taking on in this piece and you know there's a couple of interaction parts i'm not sure if other lucid reality species i'm trying to remember back if there was maybe there's a little bit of interactions but just curious to hear a little bit around like the desire to have like a light in a cave to illuminate the paintings and the paintbrush to scrape off so yeah just i know there's a wide range of different people of watching vr and this may be the first time they

ever do any type of vr interactions and so i think that a lot of places will want to just not have too much interactions not to have to bother with the controllers or anything else or explaining this or that, but yeah, just curious to hear a little bit more around wanting to integrate more interactions within the piece, if that's the back you've done it. Yeah, we put some interaction in nearly all our pieces, if it's needed, I would say. It's not something we are mandatory to do, but we really produce with the idea of the audience who will look at it, what the VR experience, and especially in this cultural venues you have a very large range of ages begin at 10 and it finished at 80 years old so we need to really have very simple interaction that doesn close the story that doesn change anything you do it it's great, you enjoy it

you don't do it the story is the same and we spend quite a lot of time in different projects to find the good ones that can also explain without word just in the interaction it's a good thing so of course with Soulage it's so important the light is in the middle of his work so we don't say it when you are in the cave but just to give you the idea of the light it's not a candle, it's a torch make you also already think about what is the shadow what is the way you make a drawing appear. So even if we don't say it, I think that for the people, they can just feel it. And maybe at the end, if we ask them, they won't be able to say, yeah, you made a torch because you wanted us to learn about life.

But they feel it. And I think that after that, when they are in front of Piazzolage Works, they are more open just to look at the light. And it's the same with the moon, for example. It's not an interaction, but when you see the moon on the sea, you see the reflection, you see the reflection of the light. And so you begin to understand what you will see precisely in front of the painting. And that's all the thing we try to do in the mise-en-scene or in the creation of the interaction is really that, not to sublime, you know, very heavily look. He will use the light after that, but just to suggest it, that the light is important. And so after that, maybe people will catch a little bit of that. and it was the same for Van Gogh for example

Van Gogh's palette we spent maybe months about the interaction because we wanted something very joyful but at the same time very meaningful and of course Van Gogh is very far away from digital interaction so we needed to find things that can give something to the user without just saying look that's very important but it's a moment where the player is more distract we don't put the voice at this moment so they can be really focused on the interaction and try to understand some things yeah yeah and this piece it starts in a very like abstract white void space with like black snow and then we see these black lines that are coming down and so there's a quality of being in these kind of poetic abstractions that feels a little bit of like walking through a dream i mean

there are other moments where you're more in a room but then there's like paint that fills up and so there's always this kind of magical realism or surreality where it's like it gives this feeling of something that's in an other world and you're talking about the creative process and you know this creative imagination of Pierre Soulage and so just curious to hear a bit of this waking dream that you wanted to take people through it's easy because when you were at five years old I already loved black said Pierre Soulage so what can we do with this his family said he was painting like a stroke, black stroke and they ask me, but what are you doing Pierre? I'm doing snow so it's quite easy to represent this with 3D and with poetry way we are on his mind and this is how to

represent it I think it's more memories than a dream it's to bring the user in his memories And Pierre Soulages, what was really easy with him is that he talked a lot about his life. And, of course, Van Gogh, we have a few letters he sent to his brother, but we have no podcast or any interviews. But with Pierre Soulages, we had like hours, and he had a very specific voice that we can hear at the beginning of the experience. and he liked, really, we can feel it, he liked talking about himself, about his work, but not in a so proud way, but I mean, he was an old guy, you know, he died at 102 years old, so he had a lot of time to talk about himself and to tell stories he remembered when he was a kid,

young men after the war. So we had so many things. So I think the talent of Gordon, because I think he has a lot of talent, was also to pick some very visual idea because we were doing like a 10 or 13 minute long experience, so you cannot put everything. but what you did was really to bring the users in very specific memories of Pierre Souvalage that can explain what happened after that. And that was really the way you did. And the black at the beginning, even if it's on a white page, already say after 55 years later he will like dive in black but at 5 years old he was already saying snow in black

that's incredible you know you mentioned the run time of 10 to 12 minutes I think it's one of the shorter pieces here at Venice Immersive but in the context of like a immersive location based entertainment or within a cultural institution you have a matter of throughput of how many people can see it in an hour and like a whole setup and so there's a little bit of a trade-off of trying to get everything you need to say but also make it feel substantial enough that people have to pay extra to see it because there's a psychological thing of people if they pay extra money to see something they want it to be at least like 30 minutes to 45 minutes but a 10 minute runtime i think it's a good runtime to get a sense but it's also the economics of the pressure is to have longer experiences for people to feel like they get their money's worth and so just curious to hear a little bit around the runtime decision because it's a part of a larger lbe and the pressures are actually kind of pushing things in the opposite direction yeah in fact the duration is something we discuss with first

museum usually and 10 to 15 minutes is a good time for a museum where you have a lot a lot a lot of people because even if you have 20 headsets you need just to put the people in and out very quickly and what we note is that usually people want more that's sure they say oh it was very short I would like to stay in the experience more, but we have really no arguments or nobody who is not happy with the money we ask. But, I mean, of course, for 10 minutes or 15 minutes long, it's a few euros. I mean, we ask them six or seven euros, less in, not in the small cities. and so we adjust that. Of course, if we ask them to pay 30 euros for a 10-minute experience,

nobody will pay for that. But for 6 euros, that is like the cost of two coffees, they are very, very happy. And even if they ask more, they are not asking their money back. I mean, it's not a question of money. It's more a question of, I loved the piece and I would like to say more. so yeah we have to adapt between and adjust between the request of the museum to be able to put more people inside and the need of the people to stay more usually and we can do that we didn't do it for Outre Noir but for Van Gogh's Palette for example we did a 10 minutes long experience for the museum and a 20 minutes long experience for other commercial venues. And the two works. And some museums ask us the short version, and some venues ask us for longer version.

Yeah, that makes sense. Plus, if you're at the museum, you're likely able to then go actually look at the artwork, which I think is always a great... Like, you get even more interested in seeing the work, especially because it seems like his work is very nuanced in terms of the black and the reflections of light. And light is not easy to necessarily depict within virtual reality because there's so much more fidelity that we can see with our eyes than we can see within some virtual representation. And so I felt that going into the church scene with the stained glass type of effect of seeing the light that was muted, it was a good approximation. But I'm sure actually being there, it would be a completely different experience. It's like difficult to capture even on a camera. And so you're talking about the nuances of a light that you can only go so far of capturing the essence of someone's artwork in a virtual representation when so much of it seems to be about how it's interacting with light that is almost impossible to capture in any sort of virtualized way. So I'm imagining that going in to actually see it, people have a completely different experience that you can't necessarily represent virtually.

So I'd love to hear any thoughts on how do you handle depicting light when that's such a complicated thing to do, both in photography and film and especially in VR. It's also an abstraction, in fact. It's like a model, l'abbatial de Conque. We are not exactly on the abbatial, but we are in a representation, a mental way of experimenting this beautiful way of lighting this beautiful piece of Roman art. So, one more time, we don't want to recreate reality because it's not possible with this headset. and we always look a different way to represent the necessity of the meaning of the set. I don't know if you have any additional thoughts or comments on dealing with representing white within VR.

Yeah, of course, that was a big part of the challenge of this particular project, to represent black when you have a light screen, a lighted screen. That was something I remember that we had the support of the CNC and the CNC committee when they supported the project they said we want to see how you will do it because it impossible So I don't know if we did something that is what they expected, but at least we found ways to represent black. And sometimes it's not completely black, and sometimes it's just because you have the white that is so present that the other part of the image seems to be black. But at the end, I think everybody is looking at the painting of Tiersolage in the very last sequence and see them as they are.

Of course, it's not the definition that when you are in front of the painting. We know that, and we were quite anxious about that, because when you are in front of the painting, it's a completely different experience, like when you are in the church, it's completely different. But we try to find ways, maybe to give the idea to the user to go and see the real painting and the real church. That could be great also, but just to have some clues and some keys to understand. what Chesulaj was trying to do with his work. Yeah, I actually watched this piece twice because I saw it on the press preview day. And then I tend to watch like 20 to 30 hours of content within the course of like three or four days. And I don't usually take notes. And so I was like, wait, what happened in this piece? And I had to go back and watch it again because there was a bit of a poetic dream logic

that happens in this piece that has levels of abstraction Also, I wasn't familiar with Pierre Szilagy at all. And so it wasn't until, like, I saw the final scene, I was like, oh, okay, I got some context here of who this artist was. And so then going back to the second time, I had a better sense of, like, okay, this is where this is going. I understand this is an artist who does this type of work. But being completely unfamiliar with the work, the first run through, it wasn't until that final scene that it really clicked. Okay, this is what's happening here. And so I had to go back and watch it again just to kind of recode the information in a way that was contextualized given that artwork. And so the final scene is really beautiful and poetic in the sense that it feels like you're like in the Matrix where you have this big grid of white rectangles with black borders. And you're kind of zooming into it. It looks like my thought was, okay, where is this going? I have no idea. But then you end up in what feels like a museum that feels like it could be an actual museum

where you see this diffuse light coming in of these white panels that then have contrasted into Pierre Solage's black paintings. And that contrast between those two was really beautiful and stark and amazing. And is that a real-life exhibition location of Pierre Solage's work? and maybe just kind of elaborate a little bit on this final culminating scene to bring it all home. This glass we go through is a real one. It is the glass developed during years for the Abatial de Conque. And that's why the architect in Montpellier, in Musée Fabre, used the same glass to represent his art and his room, Pierre Soulage room. and I use this to go through, to pass through, to experience of course the contrast between the white and the black

but you can see there is some motif on this white, it's not just white, electronic white, it's always material, it's always sensibility and we pass through and go deeply near this last piece. But it's a real place. In fact, the church and the museum room are both real. They are maybe 200 kilometers away one from the other, so you cannot go from the church to the room. but we really liked this museum room also because it is not like I don't know when you are going to Louvre or if you are going to Orsay Museum the building is even more present than the paintings

in this room that was done specifically for this specific paintings from Piazzolage you see it as a very beautiful box just for these paintings and so we thought that maybe if you know the museum the Montpellier museum you will see, ok, I recognize the museum but if you don't know it you just recognize a very beautiful room where you can hold paintings and that was also important So we're looking at a picture here, and where is this at? So it is in Montpellier, Musée Fabre. Here you can see Pierre Buren, also a piece of art. But here you can see all the room for Pierre Soulages. And after, this is the painting. And this is the last room. And you can see here, it's not 3D, but this room is like a 3D room.

It's amazing. So we... It's amazing. Yeah, actually, that's the last scene in the piece, and so I've had a 3D spatial experience of it, so it's really beautiful to see the photo of it. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, so awesome. Well, what's next for this piece? Where does Ottenor go from here? So the piece is actually permanently at the Soulages Museum. That is another museum in south of France, in Rodez, a very beautiful museum. if you are going, please go and so they have only three headsets it's also a museum where you don't have thousands or hundreds of thousands of visitors but they have three headsets it was presented also in Paris now it's going in different festivals and we hope it will have an international life

Awesome, and finally what do you each think is the ultimate potential of virtual reality and this type of immersive storytelling and immersive art and what it might be able to enable I think we are really at the very, very, very beginning of the potential of virtual reality so I I love to put this tool in artists' hands and I'm sure we will see quite a lot of new things. And we need, of course, more artists, more script writers, more directors, just take this and bring it very far away. We need more money, of course. we need more venues to present it and we need audiences.

But I think we did already quite a long way and it's growing quite quickly. So I'm quite optimistic for VR. I think it's a new media and a lot of people thought they have to reinvent all things. But I think it's not true. We have to build another thing, another way of narrative way, new narrative way. But it's the same thing as movie, as poetry. We have to use it and to invent it. But we don't have to reinvent everything. Things are here. We just need people with talent to explain their self with this media. Is there anything else that's left inside that you'd like to say the broader Amherst community? Any final thoughts? What is important for me is to have this kind of reunion and gathering with festivals.

But I think it's really also important that the directors or creators think about who will be the audience, the final audience, and try to make it growing. So my final thoughts would be really to always think about distribution, not only on business side, but also on creative side. Yeah. That's very good. I don't know what to say more. Maybe we can have fun also on VR. And I think everything is quite an adolescent teenager, you know. It's like the media itself. I think we can grow and have fun, have more legerté. I don't know what to say. Lightness? Lightness, yeah. and everything is deep

everything is strong we can have poetry we can have fun and I hope that's a way to reach the audience yeah lots of beauty and talking about the artistic process and yeah just really enjoyed learning more about Pierre Célage this conversation but also through the piece and yeah it's got a real poetic kind of waking dream quality of getting some biographical information about both the artists and his creative process. And yeah, just to see his work kind of exhibited in these places that I have never been. I don't know if I ever will be, but it makes me want to potentially go and check it out now. So yeah, it's just a really beautiful piece. And thanks again for joining me here on the podcast to help break it all down. Thank you so much, Ken. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thanks so much for listening to the Voices of VR podcast. And I just want to say that I'm really trying to live into the transformation economy, meaning I want to give away all this information for free, make it publicly accessible for not only you but the entire community.

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